Tonal Adjustments.. where does the happiness lie??

[Kevin]

dude.. i've got a 13 band parametric eq, Hi-pass, mid-hi pass, mid-low pass, and low pass crossover with slopeable cut off (-6db, -12db, -18db,-24db) for each crossover, timing adjustment with decible cutoffs down to -30db's per 6 channels, bass and treble controls.. all of which is built into my head unit . fantastic right? i can't make any sense out it. certain music configures fine to give me fantastic mid-bass, where as heavier, deeper noted tracks cause boat loads of distortion.. how in the hell do you find a happy medium? i listen to a mix of rap and rock..i'm just having trouble figuring out what sounds good. i'm just ranting.. but any input would help me greatly.
kevin

[jnorion]

Happiness lies about six months down the road when you've played with it the entire time and finally figured something out that you like.

[95ProLeila]

there isn't one catch-all eq setting for every different style (and even songs within a given genre). that having been said, i usually give the low low end (below 125Hz) a little extra bump and gradually curve it back down to 0 or just below for the midbass. the fundamentals for most vocals/human voice are going to land somewhere near 1KHz. Depending on how you have it set, a lot of times things in that range can get buried, so i like to give those a slight bump, too. the high end (~4KHz+), i usually just leave alone because it cuts through everything else anyway. especially in a small space when you're located right near the speakers. the high frequency waves are shorter, literally, therefore they don't need as much resonance space. keep in mind this is only how i like my eq's generally speaking. with little tweaks here and there, i can bring out everything in the texture. i like to be able to hear everything that's going on in a song, not just the low end, or mids, or whatever. keep in mind that i'm a music major, so i can be kind of anal with this type of thing, and will spend more than the duration of a song screwing with my eq (not in the car)

[Kevin]

that seemed to be the general problem with all of my setups, i myself don't know where things predominantly lay in the hz spectrum. just had a general clue that anything 10khz on up would be cimbals and anything below 80hz is non-directional.. and that all of your 'mid-bass' so to speak can be found anywhere from as low as 70.. all the way on up to 200hz.. depending on your tastes. it's that inbetween range i have trouble with because i can't quite tune it right to where it doesn't sound like the vocals are getting drowned out by the guitars. and i'm never happy with a flat, unadjusted feed in my setups.. so it only goes to show i'm never happy. i'll follow the additional information you gave me and i'll see what i can't do with it.
kevin

[95ProLeila]

if the vocals are getting covered, try turning up the 2KHz, see if you can't squeeze the overtones out, electric guitars tend to not get as many overtones (depending on a bunch of little stuff), but the vocals do because they're natural acoustic sound. try turning up the higher mids and see if the vocals can't come out a little better.

[jnorion]

I think we should have a tuning sticky with some of this information in it. Where is Blue when you need him?

[Kevin]

well the problem, joel.. is that this information is literally VERY general. i put into practice what i drew away from this thread and with 13 bands of eq juice pumping through my veins.. literally listened and ****ed with my speakers for 2 straight hours.. taking 5 minute breaks to talk with my friend (guitarist/singer). after all of the tuning.. we were able to equalize something equivalent to being in a studio WITH the band while they were recording the CD. it sounds that good.. and seems to be where my preference falls.. because anything from opeth, to kanye west, to tantric, to silvertide, to breaking benjamin, to red hot chili peppers, i can honestly say i've found something i will be happy with for a long long time. and again.. thats solely based on personal preference. the strange thing was, we were able to find approximate ranges for bass guitar, lead electrical, high end acoustical, tenor and barritone singers. and given the 'live studio' sort of EQ setting we were able to set, we were able to fully nail out a conventional 5 to 7 piece drum set. but it is tough as hell equating everything into a single set of octaves/frequencies. i wrote down my information so i will re-write what i've found.. at least given those selections i've had. only difficulty is.. i couldn't begin to tell you how many decibles + or - would give you the sound we've been able to create.. just an approximation in a scale of +3 to -3 or so. i'll update in a few days when i get a chance,
kevin

[jnorion]

I know it's general information, but it seems like it would be nice to have some guidelines that say "Vocals are found somewhere in the X khz to Y khz range, usually. Guitars are found in the X - Y range. Drums/cymbals are in the X - Y range." That and typical crossover frequencies would be nice. Something that says "Here's some basic ideas and now go spend two hours tweaking it from there." I realize that no two systems will ever sound the same nor will any two sets of ears hear things the same, but it's good to have a baseline to work from.

[95ProLeila]

How do you like the 13 band? I'm used to 7 band eq units.

[Kevin]

well.. it actually depends.. with pro-mode on the eclipse head unit.. i only get a selection of eq bands as the cross-over frequencys adopt their own EQ curve for each cross over setting you make. so you could infact end up with the same frequencies showing up 2 or 3 times along the parametric eq graph. in the normal mode, you get the full 13. given the level of selection either way.. it's a very nice feature.. but it's really futile unless you're REALLY into frequency identification. the other thing that bothers me, a 'Ride' or 'Crash' cymbal recorded on different studio tracks, mic's, equipment and what have you, there really is no general range because music today is so over produced and over tuned. equalizing further extends this level of madness.. it's so over EQ'ed and adjusted, you can't get any two songs to sound great on ONE setting. now if all you listened to was Creed.. or Nickleback.. all of their **** sounds the same anyway, so you wouldn't have that kind of problem :p:. 13 bands gives you some GREAT flexibility.. but maybe a little too much for the frequency inclined such as myself. i eventually stumbled upon something i liked.. pulling up each frequency individually to a level i liked and brought up everything around it accordingly until i was able to come to something decent sounding.
kevin

[95ProLeila]

I absolutely hate cymbals, especially as a performer and jazzer. To me, they completely cover everything, and when I'm trying to hear chord changes to improvise it's a nightmare. We're not even talking recorded or amplified, just in an acoustic setting, gah! The nice thing about recording is that you can isolate them and crank it down. There's this great saying we have "ProTools can make anybody sound good."

[jnorion]

I like keeping a practice ring at least on the crash cymbals

[95ProLeila]

I like keeping a practice ring at least on the crash cymbals

even then it still bugs me, i dunno, i have this thing about high frequencies. the trumpet player in my combo drives me up the wall

[blue LEDz]

I think we should have a tuning sticky with some of this information in it. Where is Blue when you need him?

hey, sorry it took so long for a response. i've been in panama (the country) for the past 2 1/2 weeks.


one of the reasons why i chose the processor i did was because it has 8 presets. depending on the music, i change the x-over points and EQ. it's very hard finding a happy median for varied types of music. and yes, it can take weeks or months.

[Kevin]

i'm finding out, even switching from chevelle, silvertide and stabbing westward.. some of the most frequently played cd's in my car, i can't get an eq curve that works the best because the production from each group is so drastically different in design and style, some songs you can hear the bass guitar emphasized and the drums drowned out, some you can hear the sythesized elements drowned out by the vocals. it's wierd. i keep changing it, but we'll see in due time where i find happiness.
kevin