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    capacitor test

    i found a link to this test on carsound. just goes to show caps aren't needed

    #2
    awesome test, people you should really read this test.
    '02 classic red p5
    currently enrolled in AA.

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      #3
      I need to think about this a lot more, but it would have been interesting to see if the results would have been different if they had placed the cap 6 inches away from the battery and not by the amp.

      I need to get a hold of a little more data and then play some games in the circuit simulator to see which one of the two locations (by the amp, or by the battery) makes more sense. I have had to deal with this on a (much) smaller scale in some power supplies I have worked on, and the answer was not what I assumed it would be

      When I get back to work next week I'll try to remember to run some experiments.
      --JJB--
      '02 Silver Protegé5 - 5sp - no performance mods, no plans for them
      Kenwood Z919 -- Polk Audio speakers
      16" alloys w/ 205/50 Bridgestone RE750 (summer)
      15" steels w/ 195/55 Bridgestone Blizzak LM22 (winter)

      Moon roof - wind deflector - variable intermittent wipers - electrochromic mirror w/ temp & compass
      Winter/beater car: 1997 Mercury Mountaineer with 182k on it

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        #4
        damn that sucks... can you still justify a deep cycle battery ? i was skeptical of stiffening caps, not for any particular reason, but what if anything is there you can do? is running multiple batteries going to help out? and also, if you run 2 batteries, how does your electrical system compensate for 2 batteries? are our car's electrical systems still able to regulate the voltage better with two batteries, or is that just better for competitions when you have to expect that your car will be off for testing?
        peace

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          #5
          I dont understand... my car runs at 14.1 and when abass note hits on any of my rap songs or even this cd i made from downloaded bass sweeps off Kazaa it doesnt drop below 13.3 at the most... but we hooked my friends cap up to my amp and it ran at 13.8 - 13.9

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            #6
            Originally posted by asylum24
            I dont understand... my car runs at 14.1 and when abass note hits on any of my rap songs or even this cd i made from downloaded bass sweeps off Kazaa it doesnt drop below 13.3 at the most... but we hooked my friends cap up to my amp and it ran at 13.8 - 13.9
            that's because you aren't over taxing your electrical system. the test shows that if your amps require more power than your alt can put out, then a cap will not help anything. my system will drop into the 12 volt range after a few minutes when my car is parked, and at idle. but hardly ever below 12.8 volts. and i have no cap.

            JJB, the general idea of a cap is to have a power storage unit near the amp(s) for faster delivery during peak notes. now i've also seen test of smaller systems showing the difference between having a cap in the trunk, or a battery. the battery kept the voltage up higher for longer.

            demoninvictus, deep cycle batteries will always be justified great storage of power, and they are getting the ESR and ESL ratings lower and lower. running multiple batteries can be tricky. i put a regular lead acid battery in my trunk that was huge, and primarily used for large construction equipment. well, it couldn't handle the bass, and one of the plates inside came loose, and now it will only hold about a 9 volt charge well, that cause my front battery, and excide red top spiral cell, to constantly discharge, therefor killing one of the spirals, so now that battery only holds a 10.6 volts so i have to take both back to my friend's shop and get new ones. i'll be getting 2 of the black top spiral cell ones, like the one i got for misterT. over 1000 cranking amps, and a nice reserve capacity when i get the money, i'll be putting in 2 of the stinger power2 dB batteries:p: each one will put out 1700 amps for 5 seconds and it takes 103 amps of draw from amps for 30 minutes for the battery to drop to 10 volts

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              #7
              Wow, that is amazing!! A 15 farad cap and no difference at all?!?!?! That is something else. Maybe I should trash the cap. I remember telling you how I could not tell much difference in light dimming with or without the cap on and thought maybe the cap was bad. I later was thinking that if the cap helped, it was so little, that it was not very noticeable. A guy on the other site has a JL Audio 500/1 amp and has dimming problems, but not as bad as mine. I don't think my amp is bad, perhaps it's just because it is Class A and inefficient. Especially if that guy has a Class D amp and his dimmed a little. I noticed too that it is more apparent with 2001+ models. I rewired 4 gauge from alternator to the fuse box and from the fuse box to the battery. Tonight I will know if it works. I'll keep you posted.
              2001 ES (Featured at SoundDomain)

              Pioneer/SoundStream/JBL/Coustic/Elemental Designs/Focal/
              KnuKonceptz/Lightning Audio/SoundQuest/Tiff/
              Gel America/Dynamo Deep Cycle Battery/
              Groundkit

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                #8
                Blue, do you use a battery isolater in your install? That sucks about the charge. I guess you can't drive with stereo on can you or else you too will get dimming, but worse than mine!!! I want to know how much of a load the Class A amps are taking on my battery. Stereo on and then stereo off. On and one with the music pumping. In that report, 2000 watts is a lot to put on a stock 80 amp alternator!
                2001 ES (Featured at SoundDomain)

                Pioneer/SoundStream/JBL/Coustic/Elemental Designs/Focal/
                KnuKonceptz/Lightning Audio/SoundQuest/Tiff/
                Gel America/Dynamo Deep Cycle Battery/
                Groundkit

                Comment


                  #9
                  i'm getting an isolator next week. well, actually just a high amp relay, cause that's all they are i replaced my red top with a marine battery from walmart. $50 for that crap but i need it to get around, and it's got a decent reserve capacity, so it holds enough power for my system, just not for as long as before:p:

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                    #10
                    All you had to do was tell me and I would have given you my old stock battery that was replaced by the one you got me from your friend's shop. It's just sitting on the side of the living room along the wall. You would have had to come and pick it up though because of my hernia operation! I looked in some boxes trying to find electrical tape and when I was putting one up that weighed 15-20 lbs. I felt something pull down there and got pain shots under my incision. I thought I ****ed up!! I am supposed to return to work Monday on light duty for the first 2 weeks. It will be boring, but can't be on sick leave forever. It will have been 2 weeks already do to surgery. Just glad I was able to get to the car in time before returning to work!:p:
                    2001 ES (Featured at SoundDomain)

                    Pioneer/SoundStream/JBL/Coustic/Elemental Designs/Focal/
                    KnuKonceptz/Lightning Audio/SoundQuest/Tiff/
                    Gel America/Dynamo Deep Cycle Battery/
                    Groundkit

                    Comment


                      #11
                      i totally forgot about your battery. oh well. i got a marine one from walmart, cause they have regular terminals and screw down posts

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                        #12
                        so i am greatly under the impression that voltage drops get greater as you run your system, cause at idel and pushing the system for 1 minute, my voltage stayed constant at 14.1 volts... so the real trick would be to push my system longer and harder to drop the voltage?
                        peace

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                          #13
                          if you've only got the 50x4 amp running, good luck getting it to drop the voltage specially since it's not running subs running subs requires a more constant flow of power from the amp. you need several hundred watts to really drop the voltage noticably at idle.

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                            #14
                            if capacitors arent needed? then how come headlights dont dim after they're installed?

                            thank you.
                            Tag Team

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                              #15
                              Originally posted by JProtege
                              if capacitors arent needed? then how come headlights dont dim after they're installed?

                              thank you.

                              capacitors can help the light dimming, if your alternator can supply enough power for your car and amp. with most systems today, that just doesn't happen. it's that split second when the bass first hits, and the alt regulator isn't telling the alt to put out full power, yet, that a capacitor can help. and in a decent power system, a 1 farad cap only holds a fraction of a second worth of power. and if your alternator can't keep up with the system, then the cap only adds more strain to the alt. depending on the system, just upgrading the battery will prevent headlight dim. pretty much the only reason to get a cap is to keep the voltage as level as possible for other components in the audio system, like the HU and processors, that are more effected by drops in voltage, cause that will cause distortion. if you are borderline with power, a cap will cover up the problem. if you aren't borderline, then you won't notice any difference especially with newer more efficient amps. take misterT's system. a bit smaller than mine, and he has a 1.5 farad cap, and his system dims. mine, with the class D amp doesn't dim. and i have no caps

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