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So I had a CEL (P1195) today...

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    So I had a CEL (P1195) today...

    Actually the trouble started Sunday. Drive to work fine. Start up car next time after parking for about an hour and get ready to pull out of parking lot when suddenly the engine runs quite gutless. Idles fine but under acceleration just totally bogs down. After playing with the throttle I could get around 35MPH and no more...and that takes about a mile or so. Had a CEL on for several weeks prior to this and thought it was due to the EGR vacuum port being clogged...car had driven fine otherwise and was getting good gas mileage. Drove it around and literally was gutless. Pulled over, stopped, pulled the console up and disconnected the ECU. Let it sit for a few minutes, plugged back in, drives OK now but seeming with less power than before (CEL comes back on almost right away).

    It was acting like a bad MAF based on experience so used some credits at the JY and got another one. Cleaned/plugged in the new one, reset the ECU, CEL stays off. Take it for a drive and the CEL comes back on. Go to Autozone and read the code: P1195. Of course the scanner implies its' a fuel metering problem (MAF) so I come back home and research to find it's related to the MAP/boost sensor. I happen to have another MAP sensor assembly from a 98 Protege that I gutted parts from weeks ago so plug in the replacement assembly, connect the vacuum lines, connect the electrical connectors, reset ECU. Start the car and the idle is crazy high. Stop, start again, same thing. Try to drive it and it's gutless again.

    Come back home, disconnect the replacement MAP sensor and plug in just the old one. Start it up...back to normal idle. Drive it around, no more CEL.

    WTF? The only thing I ended up changing from the original assembly is the part where the vacuum line goes from the EGR test port to the MAP sensor. I'm guessing that was the bad part.

    Anyways I hope the issue is solved. I have a replacement manifold waiting just as soon as I'm certain the EGR passage is totally clear..been blowing out the two passages (one on top and one on the bottom just behind where the TB mounts...the passages join up along the back side then curl down to where the EGR actually mounts)...top passage is done and the other part is still clogged (I test it by putting the whole manifold in the bathtub and using some vinyl hose to blow air into the main EGR port...I see bubbles coming clearly out of one passage but not the bottom one...for some reason it seems to clog more thoroughly). I might end up drilling out the plug on the side and cleaning it out that way then plugging the hole with epoxy. Damn I can't believe what a disaster the EGR passage is...no wonder it gets plugged up.
    ________
    Kid Zoloft
    Last edited by smokstac; 04-20-2011, 07:36 PM.

    #2
    if you drill out the plus would be better off either getting a new plug, or buying a npt tap and a pipe plug, the epoxy could break off in the manifold with heat and cooling.
    97 protege dx few mods

    94 escort lx heavily modded

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      #3
      Even the steel reinforced epoxy? Good to know.
      ________
      TOTAL DRAMA ISLAND ADVICE
      Last edited by smokstac; 04-20-2011, 07:36 PM.

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        #4
        if u can reach the inside you can press teh epoxy but if u can't, it might not fill properly and cause a flake when pushed in.
        97 protege dx few mods

        94 escort lx heavily modded

        Comment


          #5
          Is it possible that the lower port isn't used on the 1.5L engines (looking inside behind where the TB mounts)? For the life of me no matter how much carb cleaner I spray into that port, letting it soak overnight, or letting carb cleaner sit inside the EGR port leading into the manifold I cannot get anything else out (the carb cleaner runs out clean), and, if I put the manifold in a tub of water I get no bubbles coming out (the top port flows perfectly...it was plugged but came clean using a tube and my mouth to blow inside of it). The metal plug on the side seems rather thick...I thought I could knock it out like one knocks out a freeze plug but no go.

          Anyways when cleaning the manifold I got lots of carbon out of it...until this point. It leads me to believe that the lower EGR port is closed off completely (and not by carbon or coke buildup).

          I hate to tinker if it's not intended to be opened up.
          ________
          Buy No2
          Last edited by smokstac; 04-20-2011, 07:36 PM.

          Comment


            #6
            I have not had my mani off yet so i can't tell from experience on this one, but it does sound as if that one is blocked off. Most vehicles that have a egr circulation pipe from teh exhaust only have 1 port in the mani to let the gas in, the egr valve is what controls the flow, except in your situation where is was blocked by carbon.
            I say if the mani is fresh and clean now to just put that puppy back together , unless you want to do a port and gasket match while u r at it.
            97 protege dx few mods

            94 escort lx heavily modded

            Comment


              #7
              I am a bit curious as to why there would be a lower port there. If you look at the mani and trace the EGR flow you can see the drilled out portions which form a sort of backwards C around the neck of the intake where the TB bolts on. Obviously something was drilled and blocked off with what looks like a rather solid metal plug...but why? I wonder if the intake was used on other engines and simply blocked off depending on where the engine would be sold (i.e. CA, non-CA, non-USA)?

              My Rodeo has a single port that goes into the intake so it's rather obvious there's no crooked or twisted passages. It gets plugged too but it's simply to unplug since it is straight.
              ________
              How to boil
              Last edited by smokstac; 04-20-2011, 07:37 PM.

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                #8
                I think I'm going to leave it alone and install it like it is as I'll have the chance with the old (still installed) manifold to see if my theory is correct or not. Once I get the manifold and TB gaskets (and new injector O-rings) I'll install it. Hopefully it will eliminate the issues with the EGR port being plugged and triggering a CEL (which has popped back up, incidentally).
                ________
                ALTORFER BROS. COMPANY
                Last edited by smokstac; 04-20-2011, 07:37 PM.

                Comment


                  #9
                  I was just thinking, that hole might be from how the manifold is injection cast molded, could be wrong but might be a reason. Another possibility is that maybe the engineers had plans on doing something different and at the last minute changed them and didn't bother altering the molds.
                  97 protege dx few mods

                  94 escort lx heavily modded

                  Comment


                    #10
                    I think it's a pretty solid plug compared to the larger ones on the manifold (which look just like freeze plugs) so I'm fairly satisfied that I've decarboned the entire inside (between several cans of carb cleaner to soaking in the hottest water in the tub and using vinyl tubing and my mouth to blow air through the entire EGR and PCV passages). There's plenty of air flow out the top hole now (it was plugged before) so I'm going to leave well enough alone. Once I get the gaskets needed I'll put the cleaned manifold on and hopefully squash the CEL that keeps coming back on.

                    As an aside my engine started bogging down again over the past two days to the point of trying to stall at a stop light. Since this started last weekend I noticed the exhaust didn't smell so well (this is one of my personal tests used to determine engine condition). If the exhaust burns my eyes something is wrong (wafting it towards me while parked like one wafts fumes in a lab). On a hunch I remembered all this started after replacing the fuel pump/sender gasket on the cage last week. Went to the JY today to get a replacement pump/sending unit/cage, installed it, and it seem to make a huge difference. Thus far the engine doesn't want to die under acceleration and the exhaust is clean smelling again.

                    Odd thing about all this is that resetting the PCM/ECU would for a time get rid of the issue (probably since the computer is reset to default values). After several starts, parking, and restarts the issue of lack of acceleration and wanting to die at WOT came back over the past two days as it did last Sunday when all this started. This morning it started to want to die at traffic lights unless I pumped the accelerator a bit. Now it's spewing steam/water as it should once warmed up instead of putting out noxious exhaust. Weird how what appears to be a random fuel pump failure would make the exhaust smell bad and cause a 3-5MPG drop in fuel mileage (I keep logs everytime I get gas so I can spot issues right away).
                    ________
                    Zoloft pregnancy
                    Last edited by smokstac; 04-20-2011, 07:37 PM.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Update to this thread: the culprit turned out to be the upstream O2 sensor. Based on my experience I thought it was the following in order causing the fluttering, lack of power, and general gutless performance up until around 40MPH: mass airflow sensor, fuel pump, fuel regulator. On a whim I picked up an upstream O2 sensor after listening to the car while parked...something seemed to be interfering with the computer's ability to regulate fuel. Being that switching none of the aforementioned worked (the trouble went away if the PCM was reset but randomly came back after several start/stop cycles) the last logical step was one or both of the O2 sensors (which is odd considering that the gas mileage didn't change much nor did the exhaust exhibit any strange behavior other than smelling like there was unburnt fuel in there).

                      Changed the O2 sensor and have been driving for a few days without issue. Performance is back to normal, gas mileage is back to normal, and the exhaust smells clean and produces a normal amount of steam when the temp. is near the dew point.

                      Odd that the OBDII system didn't throw a code...I guess the upstream O2 sensor isn't monitored in this generation of Proteges.

                      Anyways now it idles perfectly smooth without any vibration and there are now no dead spots in acceleration. Drives like a new car actually. It was a bit fussy from time to time when pulling out from a parking lot since I got it but even that's gone away now.

                      The CEL is still there but that should go away once I replace the intake manifold and the boost sensor is able to detect engine vacuum properly from the port by the EGR.
                      ________
                      Face Humping
                      Last edited by smokstac; 04-20-2011, 07:38 PM.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        glad to hear it is running well for you now. As far as a faulty pump issue, the lower the pressure the pump puts out the less the fuel is atomized, this condition results in alot of fuel not being burnt and passing into the exhaust, lack of power, hesitation, and possible engine ping or deiseling.
                        97 protege dx few mods

                        94 escort lx heavily modded

                        Comment


                          #13
                          wow i'm so glad i found this thread, my wifes car is doing exact same thing yours is, i'm going to buy that oxygen sensor tomorow.
                          2003.5 MSP number 97 (summer ride/open track car)
                          1998 Protege 1.5L/auto (wifes car)
                          1990 323 1.6 (winter ride/?)
                          1977 Honda XL100 enduro (project/summer ride)
                          1973 Ford Maverick (347 stroker)

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                            #14
                            Well I finally got around to completing my work...replacement of the exhaust and intake manifolds to squash the CELs.

                            Now that the intake has been replaced with a cleaned one and the exhaust has been replaced so the EGR can flow properly I'm running into an odd issue: around 45MPH or so I detect a slight flutter/misfire that wasn't there prior to replacing the manifolds. I'm suspecting it's due to the EGR's ability to flow properly as the flutter only seems to occur at light throttle between 45-55MPH.

                            Car runs like a champ otherwise, idles smooth, exhaust gases have no odor now. Funny thing was that when I replaced the exhaust I couldn't separate the exhaust from the pre-cat so I ended up having to drop the assembly down through the car...in the process damaging the O2 sensor's wiring and the same issue came back as before (lucky I got a spare in case something happened).

                            Anyone notice a slight flutter in their cars around 45MPH or so? (it feels like a misfire but I'm getting no CEL or nothing...and it only happens as noted at slight throttle between 45-55MPH).
                            ________
                            LovelyWendie99
                            Last edited by smokstac; 04-20-2011, 07:38 PM.

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                              #15
                              Strange enough the problem I was noticing has gone away. Now at 45MPH there is no perceived miss or slight stutter with the throttle partially opened. Weird. Runs perfect now; getting around 33-34MPG while around town (better than before I replaced the manifolds and upstream O2 sensor).
                              ________
                              BODY SCIENCE
                              Last edited by smokstac; 04-20-2011, 07:38 PM.

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