Protege-EGR Valve Problems!

[aaronsinclair]

I just got done doing a ring job on my 98 protege. With the help of all of you here at club protege, it was alot easier. Thanks to all that helped.

Now, I have a new problem. Last year I was having problems passing my emmisions test. I bought a new egr and the cel went off, and I passed. This year, the car is throwing another egr code. The same one. I took it out and cleaned it already, but it came back on again. What is the deal with proteges egr valves. Do they suck or what. Is there anything else I can do to fix the problem. EGR's are expensive. I want to know if there is anyway to maybe get rid of the darn thing and still pass? Probably not, but any suggestions would help me greatly. Is anyone else having problems with there egr?

[rusty]

did you clean out the port on the intake manifold when you pulled the egr off? If you didn't I would hightly recommend doing so. Before doing so you may also want to check to see if you are getting vacuum at the egr.

[JZProwler]

Yea, it is possible that the vacuum line that goes to the EGR itself has a crack or is leaking somewhere causing your problems

[rusty]

there is also a egr vaccum solenoid before the egr that opens and closes the valve that runs off of vacuum.

[Project Protoge]

Get a can of brake cleaner and a dental pick. You might as well start at the throttle body and clean the two ports just inside where it bolts up. They gum up and don't let any air flow through. You have to spray them and let them soak for a short time then use the pick to try and clean the passage. You also will need to do this down below at the port for the boost sensor. You will need to repeat the cleaning and soaking process until you can spray the brake cleaner and it flows freely without spraying back at you.

[beetle_orange]

if someone is planning on doing this i hope you guys take lots of pictures

[9296D21B14]

EGR/boost sensor port cleaning

I have had this problem for several months. CEL P1195. Are the two EGR ports behind the throttle body accessible for cleaning without taking off the throttle body? Is the boost sensor port accessible without taking off the intake manifold? I have tried to spray and pick through the boost sensor port where the vacuum hose connects but the drill bit I was using felt like it was hitting something solid and I didn't want to break it off or worse. I can't see or locate the throttle body ports through the throttle body with the valve opened. With or without pictures, any additional detail on this would be a great help. 98 1.5l, auto, 209k. Also, what harm, if any, could be done to the engine by doing nothing and allowing the boost sensor/EGR system not to function because of the clogged ports? Thanks.

[JZProwler]

Well, the EGR system is used to reduce NOx emmissions, if it doesn't actuate at all, it really wont cause any problems besides a MIL, you may notice a bit more power when cruising though.
If it's stuck open, thats when you'll really notice problems. basically at idle, the engine will run like crap very consistently, as the A/F mixture will be leaned out a bit because of the exhaust gas being re-introduced to the combustion chamber, causing a rough idle. It shouldn't mis-fire, just run very rough. Also, under WOT you'll notice a loss of power, because at WOT the PCM allows bit more fuel into the combustion chamber, but if the EGR valve allows exhaust gas back in again, that will lean it back out and cause a loss of power.

It won't really hurt anything significantly...just cause a very shaky engine at idle, and loss of power everywhere.

hopefully thats of some help, and proves school is teaching me something i dont know! =P

[beetle_orange]

since a lot of people are having problems with this i hope someone can make a "how to"

[ericsmith32]

Can you guys bypass the egr? On the aspire I made a block-off plate so basically the egr is sealed off but still plugged in so no cel. Idle is alot smoother and runs better. Is the protege different in how it uses the egr? Of course won't pass emissions but here in kansas we don't have any.

[JZProwler]

I would assume its very possible to put a blockoff plate between the valve and the intake, just cut a plate that matches up with the valve, and put a gasket on each side sealing the valve from the intake. If you want, you could also remove the steel tube that runs the exhaust gas from the exhaust manifold to the EGR valve. As long as the vacuum and electrical connections are left in place, the computer won't know the difference, as long as the valve is operating properly, since it can't monitor NOx outputs.

On OBDII cars I wouldn't see a problem passing emmisions, since the valve is working properly, and as far as I know, when testing an OBDII they just hook up a scanner and read what the computer tells them, as long as everything is working properly and no MIL is illuminated, the car passes. OBDI would have the problem, since they are still put the car on the dyno and a exhaust gas analyzer is used to test the emissions.

[ericsmith32]

I just put the plate on the egr side of the gasket. Eliminating the need for two gaskets. But the egr setup uses the intake manifold for everything, no tube from the manifold or where ever it comes from. So I guess on yours it would need two gaskets. The escorts boys have a similiar egr setup and they do that mod successfully all the time.

[JZProwler]

dur, good point. You would only need one gasket between the Intake manifold and the blocking plate...unless you didnt remove the tube coming from the exhaust manifold.
Actually, a decent amount of cars that I have seen with EGR's run the exhaust back through the head, through a passage in the intake, to the EGR, then into the actual intake manifold itself.
I wonder why none of us ever thought of this in the past, especially with so many people having problems with the device...

[ericsmith32]

I have internet searching and then thinking disease, so unless you spend 8+ hrs on the internet a day wouldn't surprise me (i need to find another job or cancel my internet at home). I was a member of 10+ forums at one time and alot of mods are interchangable some of things people think of are well amazing and sometimes disturbing.

[Project Protoge]

I have a spare intake manifold so I will take some pics and post tommorow evening. Also I wouldn't block off the egr, it wont help on horsepower as far as noticable gains and may cause a CEL since it is computer controlled. If you don't fix the vaccum port your boost sensor will read no vaccum and will not be able to provide the ecu with information to help keep the proper air fuel mixture. The reason you have trouble getting the stuff cleaned out is because it is not like oil it is more like carbon build up from the egr being so close to it and carbon is harder than most steel.