GI: YCW Reference Series Coilovers

[cybrphantom]

Let's try this again. This is the mount . You telling me it's not offset. U can clearly see the bigger gap at the bottome than top and u telling me that's because of caster adjustment bracket.... oh wait left to right is different widths as well. But yet it's not offset but because of adjustment plate ?

[/QUOTE]

[MFactory]

Yes, it is offset in the image (I have said that, twice)

Top/Bottom is camber
Left/Right is caster

If you want the ball-joint centred, then you can adjust it in all 4 directions till you get it to sit how you require.

"Centred" is in relation to the 4 studs, not the shape/gap on the top mount

[cybrphantom]

Proper centered camber plate see how it's equally distant


Ycw Off Center plate that are not equally distant


All other coilovers / camber mounts are centered like the blue one pictured. And my understanding was that the final product was supposed to be corrected and centered as above picture after a conversation with the engineer that i bet never happend. The design is wrong and were told to correct several times.

[MFactory]

Look at the image you posted of the blue top mount. Look at the ball joint and how it is "centred" within the 4 studs. DISREGARD the blue portion of the top mount. Just look at the ball joint and the 4 studs. Now, what happens if you move the ball joint? Yup, you guessed it, it is now "offset".

Now, look at the image of our top mount. What happens if you move the ball joint and/or the caster bracket so that the ball joint is "centred" within the 4 studs (again, DISREGARD the black portion of the top mount)? Yup, you guessed it, it is now "centred".

The Blue or Black portion of the top mount could be shaped like Mickey Mouse, but that doesn't change how the ball joint is positioned relevant to the 4 studs. THAT is what matters, and is how camber/caster is adjusted

I'm sorry if you don't understand anything that I said in my replies to you explaining how to "centre" the ball joint, but I honestly don't know how else to explain it to you.

And I'm sorry that you think that I'm constantly lying to you, and that I don't talk to the engineer with regards to changes, or I'm deliberately delaying shipments/production so that I can add other orders on etc etc

Seriously, enough, please...

[projectb10]

I never said anything about camera angle. I said "It just looks off-centre in the image because of how the studs/caster is positioned"

The holes on the top mount are elongated, so depending on where the studs/caster bracket is positioned in relation to the top mount, the ball joint "may" or "may not" be off-centre

If you do not set it to positive caster, then the ball-joint will be centred in relation to the studs, otherwise, it will be off-centre (like in the image)

Correct.

The top mount as pictured is "upside down" in the context of it how it would appear in top view when mounted in position on the car. The top mount would also be flipped so that the slots run top to bottom (in the context of the picture) not side to side as shown.

The top mount when placed in position and bolted in place is "pinched" in place or sandwiched between the U shaped bracket with the mounting studs and the underside of the strut mounting position.

The top mount must obviously be orientated correctly (when mounted up to the car) so that it can be adjusted along the slots to dial in the positive/neutral/negative caster setting required for the set up.

Sorry MFactory; I should have posted this picture up in the first place.

[MFactory]

Correct.

The top mount as pictured is "upside down" in the context of it how it would appear in top view when mounted in position on the car. The top mount would also be flipped so that the slots run top to bottom (in the context of the picture) not side to side as shown.

The top mount when placed in position and bolted in place is "pinched" in place or sandwiched between the U shaped bracket with the mounting studs and the underside of the strut mounting position.

The top mount must obviously be orientated correctly (when mounted up to the car) so that it can be adjusted along the slots to dial in the positive/neutral/negative caster setting required for the set up.

Sorry MFactory; I should have posted this picture up in the first place.

Thanks for helping to clarify

[KAinjection]

We have a problem. See the attached images if they will work.

Due to the changes in your production parts the spring that would work before is now too long. Since your lower perch is thicker and the upper perch is deeper, I can't achieve the same ride height before everything is touching and can't be adjusted any further.


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[MFactory]

How far off your original ride height are you?

[KAinjection]

Hard to say without installing them, but in the picture I would still have go down more on the spring perch since at its current position I have to compress the spring to seat the top perch on the shaft, more then the standard "snug" pre-load


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[MFactory]

The reason for the longer springs was to try to keep any coil-bind at a minimum over bumps. If you go for a shorter spring, you "may" also need to go up a spring rate to compensate.

What we might need to do is forego the 1pc lower spring perch in favour of the regular 2pc lower spring perch for those who may have the same lowering height issue.

Could you give it a try, and maybe post up a few images of the car sitting at the lowest height setting? If you could also try to snap an image of the spring as well (under load) so I can see how much spring travel there is left. If this is sufficient, you may not need to go up a spring rate with a shorter spring.

[KAinjection]

That's how it sat before I pulled them. I am not super low as I can still get 1 finger between the fender and tire.

As for a compressed shot I will try to get one tonight.


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[KAinjection]

Ok instead of going through installing these and trying to guess at compression and how much is usable from a picture, lets just measure and use specs.

You have about 5" of stroke on your dampers and then if you factor in the bump stop we can say 4"...

With that in mind this is the front spring we are using in RED, or if its not give me the part number as I cant find the box they came in:

Part #	Spring Rate		Usable Stroke		Max Stroke		Max. Load
kgf/mm	lbs/inch	mm	inch	mm	inch	kgf	lbs
Z65-203-040	4.0	224	132	5.2	139	5.5	557	1,228
Z65-203-050	5.0	280	126	5.0	133	5.2	666	1,468

Based off this we will hit the bump stop before we bottom this spring out.

On the other hand if we go to a 7" spring instead of the current 8" in the same 5K rate: We are still going to be hitting the bump stop before we use up the usable stroke.

Part #	Spring Rate		Usable Stroke		Max Stroke		Max. Load
kgf/mm	lbs/inch	mm	inch	mm	inch	kgf	lbs
Z65-178-040	4.0	224	120	4.7	122	4.8	487	1,074
Z65-178-050	5.0	280	110	4.3	121	4.7	603	1,329

I can assure you that even fully loaded and hitting a few hard bumps that I wasnt close to hitting the bump stops or using up the travel and from the marks on the spring it only bound the very bottom coil.

If you insist on using a 5K spring then you will be fine with using a 1" shorter spring although I still personally feel that you should be at least using a 6K spring in front.

Also BTW, this Castor adjustment plate you guys have is very annoying. Trying to hold it in place while putting the nuts on the top mount is cumbersome or if somebody wants to install a strut tower bar later on and you take the nuts off it will fall off. A traditional Camber/Castor plate would have been a far better choice.

[projectb10]

......With that in mind this is the front spring we are using in RED, or if its not give me the part number as I cant find the box they came in:.........

Part Number: Z65-203-050
Spring Rate: 5 kgf/mm 279.9842 lbs/inch
Usable Stroke: 126m / 4.96062992125984 inch
Max Stroke: 133.2mm / 5.24409448818898 inch
Max Load: 666 kgf / 1468.2636 lbs

Part Number: Z65-228-040
Spring Rate: 4kgf/mm 223.98736lbs/inch
Usable Stroke: 98m / 4 inch
Max Stroke: 158.7mm / 6.24803149606299inch
Max Load: 634.8 kgf / 1399.48008lbs

[therieldeal]

A couple simple ideas that would solve the castor adjuster-falling-apart problem... might work well on future batches of these and maybe your other platforms too if they are designed the same way:

• Use pressed-in studs instead of socket head cap screws.
• Put a couple small (like, 5mm wide) slots in the center section of the U shaped piece. Slot should be the same length as the slotted holes in the main strut mount.
• Use corresponding short M5 button-head screws & washers to lock the U-shaped piece to tapped holes in the camber plate.
• If you set this up with the base of the U facing outboard, you could easily access these small screws to loosen them when you want to adjust caster.
• Otherwise, they stay tight and your caster setting won’t change/things won’t fall apart when you remove your strut tower bar.

To prevent the falling apart problem on existing units, pushing a couple of these onto the top side between the body and your STB. would at least prevent parts from falling, although removing your strut tower bar could still result in an alignment change. https://www.fastenal.com/products/details/11264795 (not 100% sure this is the right size). Personally i'm just going to use two nuts (as i've always done anyway), one to secure the suspension to the car and a second set to secure the strut tower bar.

I think it makes complete sense that the center of the plate is offset. There is no reason why anyone would ever want less caster than the BG comes with stock (and if they do for some crazy reason, swap sides!). So, maxed out in one direction = centered = stock caster. All of your adjustability is in the other direction, yielding more adjustability than would otherwise be possible.

Back to the spring discussion

[93BlkOnGreenPro]

A couple simple ideas that would solve the castor adjuster-falling-apart problem... might work well on future batches of these and maybe your other platforms too if they are designed the same way:

• Use pressed-in studs instead of socket head cap screws.
• Put a couple small (like, 5mm wide) slots in the center section of the U shaped piece. Slot should be the same length as the slotted holes in the main strut mount.
• Use corresponding short M5 button-head screws & washers to lock the U-shaped piece to tapped holes in the camber plate.
• If you set this up with the base of the U facing outboard, you could easily access these small screws to loosen them when you want to adjust caster.
• Otherwise, they stay tight and your caster setting won’t change/things won’t fall apart when you remove your strut tower bar.

To prevent the falling apart problem on existing units, pushing a couple of these onto the top side between the body and your STB. would at least prevent parts from falling, although removing your strut tower bar could still result in an alignment change. https://www.fastenal.com/products/details/11264795 (not 100% sure this is the right size). Personally i'm just going to use two nuts (as i've always done anyway), one to secure the suspension to the car and a second set to secure the strut tower bar.

I think it makes complete sense that the center of the plate is offset. There is no reason why anyone would ever want less caster than the BG comes with stock (and if they do for some crazy reason, swap sides!). So, maxed out in one direction = centered = stock caster. All of your adjustability is in the other direction, yielding more adjustability than would otherwise be possible.

Back to the spring discussion

Logical thinking. Thank you.

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