BG awd swap question

[kcbhiw]

kcbhiw i was under the impression that the bf and bg awd tranz were pretty much the same, except maybe the spline count for the axles.

i would like to see a side by side of both bg and bf awd tranz, maybe jay can help with that one now,i do have both bg and bf awd tranz'es sitting around, but they are in shed with a bunch of **** infront of them, i will get some pics, but not untill next spring.

also iirc you can hybrid the bg and bf axles by changing the outer cv joints.

to anyone with a bg......
if you could get a bg awd stuff, the front would have been a lot less moding, probably just subframe moddin and moving the rack up, the rear would be very much the same as kcbhiw did tho.

a side note for fwd guys with bf's,,, on my 88 323 fwd (was a sohc 4 speed car,now a boosted bp) i did put a bg fwd rear subframe into the bf, but on the bg trailing arm front most bolt holes need a sleeve to accomadate the bf smaller sized bolt, and new mounting holes had to be drilled to fit the bf holes, and iirc i had to run bf top strut mounts.

The spline count between the BF/BG axles are indeed different. Furthermore, the BF tranny stands the engine straight up whereas the BG trans leans the engine forward about 8-10 degrees.

The configuration of the center differential is different between the two units. The design found in the BG unit is much more robust and stout than that of the BF. IIRC, the BF trans routes ALL power through some sort of planetary gear, then to the respective front/back diffs/axles.

[FE3-323]

the forward lean helps cooling believe it or not

[ryan1]

The spline count between the BF/BG axles are indeed different. Furthermore, the BF tranny stands the engine straight up whereas the BG trans leans the engine forward about 8-10 degrees.

The configuration of the center differential is different between the two units. The design found in the BG unit is much more robust and stout than that of the BF. IIRC, the BF trans routes ALL power through some sort of planetary gear, then to the respective front/back diffs/axles.

yeah i new about the bg tilt forward and bfs are stright up, when i swaped a bp in my 88 323 i had to make a custom mount for the pass side, and i just leveled off the bp motor to make the custom mount., that car is still running the weak bf b6 sohc tranz....

iirc you can swap the bg outers to the bf awd axles, i never tryed it personally,but i think bf guys run bg awd tranzes and do it just backwords, bg inner and bf outer to fit the bf knuckle.

****configuration of the center differential is different between the two units.*****
intresting, i will try to get some picks of the bg vs bf awd trannies side by side this spring.

from what i have heard, the bf 1.6 dohc gtx awd tranz and the
stock u.s. spec bg 1.8 sohc awd tranz are the same strength wise, and the bg j-spec 1.8 dohc gtx tranz is stronger.

[kcbhiw]

****configuration of the center differential is different between the two units.*****
intresting, i will try to get some picks of the bg vs bf awd trannies side by side this spring.

from what i have heard, the bf 1.6 dohc gtx awd tranz and the
stock u.s. spec bg 1.8 sohc awd tranz are the same strength wise, and the bg j-spec 1.8 dohc gtx tranz is stronger.

Externally, the dimensions are very similar. The configuration I referred to is internal.

[ryan1]

Externally, the dimensions are very similar. The configuration I referred to is internal.

o.k. i see, but......
then i guess im not sure why you had to run your mounts straight up like a bf and not the bg tilt on your awd tracer hybrid.
in your build post you said it had to much of a lean(stock bg style mounts) for the d/s to fit, well if externally the bf and bg awd tranz are close to the same im not sure why you ran into this problem, the awd bg's in stock form still have the tilt.
im not doubting your reason for running it the way you did,i just want to know why?

[kcbhiw]

o.k. i see, but......
then i guess im not sure why you had to run your mounts straight up like a bf and not the bg tilt on your awd tracer hybrid.
in your build post you said it had to much of a lean(stock bg style mounts) for the d/s to fit, well if externally the bf and bg awd tranz are close to the same im not sure why you ran into this problem, the awd bg's in stock form still have the tilt.
im not doubting your reason for running it the way you did,i just want to know why?

The tilt is determined by the bell housing bolt pattern. The BG transmission maintains the same forward tilt of the engine as its FWD counterpart. Likewise, the BF tranny maintains the upright position. Due to the BF's bell housing bolt pattern, had I leaned the engine forward, the rear tranny output would have pointed upwards toward the floor pan.

im not doubting your reason for running it the way you did,i just want to know why?

Doubting or not, I enjoy the discussion . Hopefully, it all will result in a few more AWD runners that were formerly FWD.

[ryan1]

The tilt is determined by the bell housing bolt pattern. The BG transmission maintains the same forward tilt of the engine as its FWD counterpart. Likewise, the BF tranny maintains the upright position. Due to the BF's bell housing bolt pattern, had I leaned the engine forward, the rear tranny output would have pointed upwards toward the floor pan.


Doubting or not, I enjoy the discussion . Hopefully, it all will result in a few more AWD runners that were formerly FWD.

o.k. cool,great info,,,, i hope more do the awd swap also, maybe i will one day on escort gt, but for now my 2 awd mazda's will do.

[jay]

Awright, I'll bite. How does the forward tilt help with cooling?

[SgtRauksauff]

With the forward tilt, the oilpan is angled on the bottom also. And it has slight fins on it. So, with the slight increase in volume of oil, it forms a larger heat sink, therefore helps cooling?

OR

With the forward tilt, there is a slightly lesser amount of exhaust tubing routed in the engine bay, to cause less heat buildup?

OR

With the forward tilt, air will come into the engine bay, and then flow naturally down the face of the engine, using convection to slightly cool the engine?

OR

I've actually no clue, but just wanted to attempt to be humorous.


--sarge

[jrally]

Or was it more for hood clearance and firewall clearance for the bigger engine..? I like the humor part better. I stood a BP straight up in the Festiva rally car without issue. The BP in the Escort rally car has a shortened oil pan that may or may not have caused oiling/cooling issues in the past.

-Jon R.

[Racerboy]

yes but are they 90-91 awd proteges or 88-89 mazda 323 gtxes?

AWD proteges. Why doesn't anyone seem to believe me???

[teqnyck]

AWD proteges. Why doesn't anyone seem to believe me???

Because they're rare as ****. Junkyards don't normally have two or three of them just laying around. I'm not calling you a liar, I'm just answering your question.

[SgtRauksauff]

MUHAHAHAHAA!!!!

I might just have to go scouting around the junkyards in your neck of the woods to see what I can find....

or not. I've got too many projects as it is...

[Racerboy]

You would'nt find them, lol! They're inside a building that is off limits, so that people (like you guys, lol!) won't find them and try to buy them.

[SgtRauksauff]

Now you've let me know that they've got separate buildings, which narrows down the target pool. Just got to make friends with them, buddy up, and bring my team of night-time Ninja Car Extractors along.....

--sarge